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DAO soft fork voting on Ethpool & Ethermine

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  • GenoilGenoil 0xeb9310b185455f863f526dab3d245809f6854b4dMember Posts: 769 ✭✭✭
    bitcanuck said:

    Genoil said:


    Anyway good point on the servers, that shouldn't be on your shoulders.

    @Genoil That's a red herring. Cloud servers are sold by the resource level; i.e. 1 core + 1G RAM, 2 core + 2G RAM, etc. Splitting the pool in two would not require double the resources, even if they were on separate server instances.
    He says he runs dedicated servers, probably with a good reason. As for the resources, either physical or virtual, you can't simply split them in half because you don't know which fork people will choose.
  • FittsyFittsy TexasMember Posts: 9
    edited June 2016
    dr_pra said:

    Since day one all relevant information regarding the pools were announced in this forum. Also we created a thread on Reddit which is currently on the front page of the Ethereum sub.

    But you are right we will add a link from the pool to this thread.

    Many of us are probably newbs and just using your pool. There is no info on your pool that I can find that says you post news here. I stumbled on this on accident.

    You might want to put up a link to a thread/here from your FAQ/help page.
    The link you have now is for "information on ethereum mining" not information on "ethpool/ethermine".

    Again I'm a newb. Apologies if I'm just overlooking the obvious.
  • SrPolilocoSrPoliloco Member Posts: 2
    Voting yes to soft-fork is almost voting yes to a later hard-fork.
    Pretty risky for Ethereum in my opinion.

    A spanish article related: http://criptonoticias.com/ethereum-propone-muy-arriesgado-hard-fork-rescatar-dao/
  • dlehenkydlehenky Member Posts: 2,249 ✭✭✭✭
    @SrPoliloco I can't read your link, but your assertion is not true, whether that comes from the article or not. It is not even certain, at this point, if a hard fork is needed to free up the frozen Child-DAO tokens after the soft fork. It would be great if these "journalists" actually had a clue about the topic on which they were reporting, rather than continuing the spread of mis-information. How can people be expected to make informed decisions when the world is awash in half-truths, omissions, inaccuracies, and, on occasion, outright lies?
  • sillytunasillytuna Member Posts: 38 ✭✭
    Miners should ensure they understand the nature of the proposed fork(s). This is still somewhat in flux but I tried to write it up cleanly (my view is the second half, feel free to ignore it).

    https://medium.com/@Alex_Amsel/understanding-proposed-ethereum-forks-6abd63a478fc#.r5skh7aqw
  • bardacudabardacuda Member Posts: 14
    sillytuna said:

    Miners should ensure they understand the nature of the proposed fork(s). This is still somewhat in flux but I tried to write it up cleanly (my view is the second half, feel free to ignore it).

    https://medium.com/@Alex_Amsel/understanding-proposed-ethereum-forks-6abd63a478fc#.r5skh7aqw

    So to be clear, this soft work would affect all DAOs and not just "The (slock.it) DAO" and its child DAOs? Does anyone know how many other DAOs are out there and how much Ether they contain and who owns them? I think that has to be addressed before any fork affecting these other DAOs is implemented.
  • sillytunasillytuna Member Posts: 38 ✭✭
    edited June 2016
    Firstly, it's easy for anyone who knows what they're doing to check. Secondly, they are all inherently flawed so it actually doesn't matter really. What it may affect is how a subsequent soft or hard fork operated, but that's always going to need to be surgical in nature. After soft fork #1, there is plenty of time to check what other daos there are and explore options. I'd be surprised if there are any dao clones with much value and dealing with them is unlikely to be problematic.
  • bardacudabardacuda Member Posts: 14
    Okay well I don't know what I'm doing so I can't check lol. That is why I am asking here. Saying it doesn't matter though is just your opinion. If I had a significant amount of Ether in an unrelated DAO that was not exploited or going to be exploited (or even if it were), that doesn't give other people the right to freeze my Ether because they say my DAO is flawed.
  • bardacudabardacuda Member Posts: 14
    If the coders want to make a soft fork that freezes the Ether in the slock.it DAO, its child DAOs, and anyone elses DAOs that willingly agrees, but ONLY those DAOs and not any other ones, then I will vote yes on that soft fork. Until then my vote is no.
  • bardacudabardacuda Member Posts: 14
    I've just seen your edit. So given that, it would be prudent in making sure we get this soft fork right before implementing it all willy nilly. That is the same reason we are in this mess in the first place. I might be surprised too if there were much ether in other DAOs that could be affected, but until we know, we can't just assume to make judgements on what happens to that ether. It's not ours to mess with.
  • sillytunasillytuna Member Posts: 38 ✭✭
    edited June 2016
    Ether in dao clones would still be locked from use without a soft fork for several days/weeks so a soft fork in the short term doesn't change that. This is just down to how the contract works.

    Post fork, if it turns out there are others affected, soft fork #2 can free them up accordingly as that has to be more surgical anyway. Note that child daos are legitimate splits and so it is a consideration for them too. However, at least some of those people have indicated in public and private they want this matter resolved properly.
  • sillytunasillytuna Member Posts: 38 ✭✭
    edited June 2016
    A soft fork to only affect the primary and child daos is more work and more prone to problems. Soft fork #2 has to be more precise. We need to buy time for that to happen.
  • dlehenkydlehenky Member Posts: 2,249 ✭✭✭✭
    @sillytuna You do realize that this is a pool-specific thread advising miners who use these pools to vote on the soft fork via the mechanism provided. @dr_pra specifically asked that the thread not stray from that topic into discussions about the pros and cons of the fork. You can easily start a new thread for that.
  • bardacudabardacuda Member Posts: 14
    I am a miner on ethermine.org and I was looking for clarification before I voted.
  • dlehenkydlehenky Member Posts: 2,249 ✭✭✭✭
    @bardacuda And I'm just relating what the OP and operator of the pools requested. It's only a few posts back; I'm not making it up.
  • bardacudabardacuda Member Posts: 14
    @dlehenky Right he said it's about the planned soft fork being voted on and not possible alternative options. But we were specifically discussing the proposed soft fork, for the benefit of myself and possibly other miners, to make a more informed decision. I don't see the problem. @sillytuna Thanks for the clarification.
  • donaldtrump2016donaldtrump2016 Member Posts: 7
    I'm all for the soft fork.. or hard fork even, whatever we do, as long as the hacker doesn't get those coins.
  • dlehenkydlehenky Member Posts: 2,249 ✭✭✭✭
    @dr_pra So you think the DDOS came from the anti-Ethereum gang, back up their buddy hacker?

    @bardacuda Whatever. Talk about Barbie dolls, if you'd like.
  • dr_pradr_pra Member Posts: 445 ✭✭✭
    Well, it could be a simple coincidence as well but the timing of the attack seems quite strange to me. Especially as during the last month the pool did not experience any DDOS attacks at all.
  • bardacudabardacuda Member Posts: 14
    dlehenky said:

    @bardacuda Whatever. Talk about Barbie dolls, if you'd like.

    You literally just posted today about people not being able to make informed decisions because of inaccuracies, omissions, etc., and when I ask for clarification on something so I can make an informed decision you want to say it's not relevant to this thread and equate it to talking about barbie dolls? What is your problem?
  • boysieboysie Member Posts: 591 ✭✭✭
  • sillytunasillytuna Member Posts: 38 ✭✭
    edited June 2016
    @dlehenky My original post did say to ignore my opinion part of the medium post. The first part is just some info. After that I was just replying to barracuda but will do so outside of this thread in future. Cheers.
  • rawmeenrawmeen Member Posts: 79
    I'm using ethermine.org and was very impressed that you've allowed us to vote on what we believe is the right path... Thank you.
    My vote is yes to the soft fork btw.
  • newmznewmz AustraliaMember Posts: 299 ✭✭✭
    I use ethpool and I also really appreciate that you asked us rather than just following your own opinion/agenda/whatever. I guess you can still ignore the vote and do what you want but at least you asked right? ;-) I bought some DAO tokens so I have an interest in the soft fork but I also believe it will benefit all of us interested in Ethereum if we don't allow the attacker/s to get away with it.
  • GreaterNinjaGreaterNinja Member Posts: 60
    I'll be voting to fork and also hard fork. My Risk assessment tells me that if we do nothing the damage will be far greater as we would empower the attacker by making it the primary stakeholder of Ethereum. Lets be clear, the attacker had malicious intent. We should not encourage malicious/illegal activity. And yes, this action is criminal in nature and jurisdiction of most countries with cyberlaws.

    Read the below article for a brief overview concerning the legality of this action.

    http://www.coindesk.com/sue-dao-hacker/

  • ClodoClodo Member Posts: 4
    I don't like this voting, it give a weight to people that can have DAO and don't want to lose it, or generally think about market consequences.
    And the fork it's about the principles of the entire ETH ecosystem.

    Think about a complementary voting:
    "Year 20xx. A new SilkRoad it's based on smart-contract on Ethereum: a market of drugs, weapons, child-pornography. FBI ask forks for lock it down. Yes or no?".

    It's a different context? Or the same voting results are expected?

    Just my cents.
  • makngeerworkmakngeerwork Member Posts: 3
    edited June 2016
    I am a Miner, I vote yes to soft and hard forks. Let's get this done and roll on. Thank you DR.
  • SrPolilocoSrPoliloco Member Posts: 2
    edited June 2016
    @dlehenky the soft-fork will freeze all the Ethers related to the DAO (mainDAO and childDAO's). Once that done, people might want to get back those Ethers, don't you think? And that will be with a hard-fork, as slock.it folks are proposing
    https://blog.slock.it/what-the-fork-really-means-6fe573ac31dd#.ej43m0wmf

    Thanks for calling me a liar, btw.
  • adasebadaseb Member Posts: 1,043 ✭✭✭
    I think the reason why miners want the soft fork is because it will freeze all 15% off the ether supply which will raise the value of ETH theoretically.

    Which is good for mining since there is less supply and price will go up.

    Most miners probably won't accept the hard fork however because it might hurt ETH price and less profits for them.

    Its all about money when its about mining.
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